Plug-in Algorithms in Managed Code

Can anyone update me on the status of the managed-code framework for plug-in algorithms? I've heard reports that it's "in the works" and "almost ready to release", and now I'm really anxious to get my hands on it!

We're still working out the delivery details for the component. Hopefully it will be available by April.

Thanks

-Jamie

Plug-in Algorithm in data mining using SQL Server 2005?

Hi,

actually i want to implement a c# component that can help third party data mining algorithm

and i want managed plug-in algorithm (without wrapper),.

is it possible to write whole application in c#

as Analysis servisce is in c++ , can we implement it in c#

thanks in advance

~Chinmay

Hi chinmayv84,

This is very curious issue. I will go develop some code for you in free time.

Javier Luna
http://guydotnetxmlwebservices.blogspot.com/

|||

I'm assuming that you're aware of the managed plug-in framework that's available for download here: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=DF0BA5AA-B4BD-4705-AA0A-B477BA72A9CB&displaylang=en#DMAPI.

This package includes the source code for a sample plug-in algorithm written in C#.

Can you clarify your scenario and why/if this does not meet your needs (since you indicate that you don't want to use a "wrapper")?

|||

hi

i think writing wrapper is not a good idea

actually i want to remove COM from this implmentation

i am tring to write component in c# which is following COM standards

can u help me , as i don't know how to write that whole COM in c#

thanks for reply

regards,

~chinmayv84

|||

The package that Raman pointed to contains all the COM interop part as well as a sample using C#. The architecture is:

- a COM function wrapper, written in Managed C++

- a C# assembly that uses the first assembly and implements the actual algorithm

- a step-by-step tutorial explaining how to add more complexity to your plug-in algorithm

The full source code for all the components in included, as well as documentation for all the classes and methods/properties.

If you choose to re-implement the first part in C#, you could follow the implementation details of the managed C++ assembly. However, due to the nature of the structures being passed back and forth between the server and the plug-in, we considered managed C++ as a much better choice, in terms of code clarity as well as performance.

Given that the server is unmanaged and C# is managed, I don't think there is a way to avoid the wrapper (whether that is a separate assembly or built-in into your assembly). And being in a separate assembly has no impact whatsoever on performance, given that they are loaded in the same memory space.

|||

actually i want to re implement the first part

can u help me , from where should i start and how to proceed

thanks in advanced

~chinmayv84

|||

I am really curious: why do you need to reimplement it?If there is a problem with the current implementation, please let us know so we can fix it. However, as I mentioned: if you want to re-implement it, a good starting point is to look at the source code for the wrapper, which is included in the download pointed by Raman

|||

There is no specific reason to reimplement it,

actually i just want to remove com part and replace it with c# component

what are the basic(minimum) things that are requried to implement it and to test it

thanks

|||

The purpose of the wrapper is so that you can write the algorithms in C# rather than COM. The native interfaces for plug-ins is COM, so they can't be "removed." However, you can do any implementation of algorithms you wish in C# due to the wrapper.

Are you asking "what are the basic things that are required to implement and test an algorithm?" or "what are the basic things that are required to implement and test a wrapper?" - because these are two completely different things.

|||

ok ,thanks for help

is it to write COM in C# ? so that wrrapper in c#

and it can handle native interface for plug-in

and i want basic things that are requried to test wrapper

|||

If you're trying the re-implement the COM interfaces in C#, it will be much harder than the managed C++ wrapper we've provided - you'll need to do your own research in that case.

Testing the wrapper would be a combination of whitebox testing and a sample plug-in written using your custom wrapper methods (similar to the one we supply with our Managed Plug-in API Framework).

Plug-in Algorithm in data mining using SQL Server 2005?

Hi,

actually i want to implement a c# component that can help third party data mining algorithm

and i want managed plug-in algorithm (without wrapper),.

is it possible to write whole application in c#

as Analysis servisce is in c++ , can we implement it in c#

thanks in advance

~Chinmay

Hi chinmayv84,

This is very curious issue. I will go develop some code for you in free time.

Javier Luna
http://guydotnetxmlwebservices.blogspot.com/

|||

I'm assuming that you're aware of the managed plug-in framework that's available for download here: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=DF0BA5AA-B4BD-4705-AA0A-B477BA72A9CB&displaylang=en#DMAPI.

This package includes the source code for a sample plug-in algorithm written in C#.

Can you clarify your scenario and why/if this does not meet your needs (since you indicate that you don't want to use a "wrapper")?

|||

hi

i think writing wrapper is not a good idea

actually i want to remove COM from this implmentation

i am tring to write component in c# which is following COM standards

can u help me , as i don't know how to write that whole COM in c#

thanks for reply

regards,

~chinmayv84

|||

The package that Raman pointed to contains all the COM interop part as well as a sample using C#. The architecture is:

- a COM function wrapper, written in Managed C++

- a C# assembly that uses the first assembly and implements the actual algorithm

- a step-by-step tutorial explaining how to add more complexity to your plug-in algorithm

The full source code for all the components in included, as well as documentation for all the classes and methods/properties.

If you choose to re-implement the first part in C#, you could follow the implementation details of the managed C++ assembly. However, due to the nature of the structures being passed back and forth between the server and the plug-in, we considered managed C++ as a much better choice, in terms of code clarity as well as performance.

Given that the server is unmanaged and C# is managed, I don't think there is a way to avoid the wrapper (whether that is a separate assembly or built-in into your assembly). And being in a separate assembly has no impact whatsoever on performance, given that they are loaded in the same memory space.

|||

actually i want to re implement the first part

can u help me , from where should i start and how to proceed

thanks in advanced

~chinmayv84

|||

I am really curious: why do you need to reimplement it?If there is a problem with the current implementation, please let us know so we can fix it. However, as I mentioned: if you want to re-implement it, a good starting point is to look at the source code for the wrapper, which is included in the download pointed by Raman

|||

There is no specific reason to reimplement it,

actually i just want to remove com part and replace it with c# component

what are the basic(minimum) things that are requried to implement it and to test it

thanks

|||

The purpose of the wrapper is so that you can write the algorithms in C# rather than COM. The native interfaces for plug-ins is COM, so they can't be "removed." However, you can do any implementation of algorithms you wish in C# due to the wrapper.

Are you asking "what are the basic things that are required to implement and test an algorithm?" or "what are the basic things that are required to implement and test a wrapper?" - because these are two completely different things.

|||

ok ,thanks for help

is it to write COM in C# ? so that wrrapper in c#

and it can handle native interface for plug-in

and i want basic things that are requried to test wrapper

|||

If you're trying the re-implement the COM interfaces in C#, it will be much harder than the managed C++ wrapper we've provided - you'll need to do your own research in that case.

Testing the wrapper would be a combination of whitebox testing and a sample plug-in written using your custom wrapper methods (similar to the one we supply with our Managed Plug-in API Framework).

Plug-in Algorithm in data mining using SQL Server 2005?

Hi,

actually i want to implement a c# component that can help third party data mining algorithm

and i want managed plug-in algorithm (without wrapper),.

is it possible to write whole application in c#

as Analysis servisce is in c++ , can we implement it in c#

thanks in advance

~Chinmay

Hi chinmayv84,

This is very curious issue. I will go develop some code for you in free time.

Javier Luna
http://guydotnetxmlwebservices.blogspot.com/

|||

I'm assuming that you're aware of the managed plug-in framework that's available for download here: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=DF0BA5AA-B4BD-4705-AA0A-B477BA72A9CB&displaylang=en#DMAPI.

This package includes the source code for a sample plug-in algorithm written in C#.

Can you clarify your scenario and why/if this does not meet your needs (since you indicate that you don't want to use a "wrapper")?

|||

hi

i think writing wrapper is not a good idea

actually i want to remove COM from this implmentation

i am tring to write component in c# which is following COM standards

can u help me , as i don't know how to write that whole COM in c#

thanks for reply

regards,

~chinmayv84

|||

The package that Raman pointed to contains all the COM interop part as well as a sample using C#. The architecture is:

- a COM function wrapper, written in Managed C++

- a C# assembly that uses the first assembly and implements the actual algorithm

- a step-by-step tutorial explaining how to add more complexity to your plug-in algorithm

The full source code for all the components in included, as well as documentation for all the classes and methods/properties.

If you choose to re-implement the first part in C#, you could follow the implementation details of the managed C++ assembly. However, due to the nature of the structures being passed back and forth between the server and the plug-in, we considered managed C++ as a much better choice, in terms of code clarity as well as performance.

Given that the server is unmanaged and C# is managed, I don't think there is a way to avoid the wrapper (whether that is a separate assembly or built-in into your assembly). And being in a separate assembly has no impact whatsoever on performance, given that they are loaded in the same memory space.

|||

actually i want to re implement the first part

can u help me , from where should i start and how to proceed

thanks in advanced

~chinmayv84

|||

I am really curious: why do you need to reimplement it?If there is a problem with the current implementation, please let us know so we can fix it. However, as I mentioned: if you want to re-implement it, a good starting point is to look at the source code for the wrapper, which is included in the download pointed by Raman

|||

There is no specific reason to reimplement it,

actually i just want to remove com part and replace it with c# component

what are the basic(minimum) things that are requried to implement it and to test it

thanks

|||

The purpose of the wrapper is so that you can write the algorithms in C# rather than COM. The native interfaces for plug-ins is COM, so they can't be "removed." However, you can do any implementation of algorithms you wish in C# due to the wrapper.

Are you asking "what are the basic things that are required to implement and test an algorithm?" or "what are the basic things that are required to implement and test a wrapper?" - because these are two completely different things.

|||

ok ,thanks for help

is it to write COM in C# ? so that wrrapper in c#

and it can handle native interface for plug-in

and i want basic things that are requried to test wrapper

|||

If you're trying the re-implement the COM interfaces in C#, it will be much harder than the managed C++ wrapper we've provided - you'll need to do your own research in that case.

Testing the wrapper would be a combination of whitebox testing and a sample plug-in written using your custom wrapper methods (similar to the one we supply with our Managed Plug-in API Framework).

Plug-in algorithm in data mining using sql server 2005-- modification for association , classifi

managed plug-in framework that's available for download here: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=DF0BA5AA-B4BD-4705-AA0A-B477BA72A9CB&displaylang=en#DMAPI.

This package includes the source code for a sample plug-in algorithm written in C#.

in this source code all .cs files are modified for clustering algorithm

if my plugin algorithm is of association or classification type then what modifications are requried in source code?

Both for classification and for association, you would have to remove the Clustering specific methods from the algorithm object ( ClusterMembership and CaseLikelihood)

If you want to implement an associations algorithm that behaves (in terms of modeling and querying) like Microsoft_Association_Rules, make sure that your plug-in supports:

- nested tables (both input and outputs) (in Metadata.GetSupInputcontentTypes and GetSupPredictContentTypes)

- PredictAssociation (start by enabling this in Algorithmmetadata.GetSupportedStandardFunctions)

For details on how to actually handle nested tables, check the "Attributes and modeling", "The Case processor" and "The Mining Case Object" articles in the CHM file coming with the sample, as well as the documentation for the Predict method of the AlgorithmBase object (same CHM file) and the comments in the sample implementation of this method

Hope this helps

bogdan

|||

is it possible to configure whole code for any type of algorithm

|||

You can have any type of algorithm that works with attribute value pairs. E.g. an attribute "Gender" can have the discrete values "Male","Female", etc., and an attribute Age could have a continuous value such as 45. The majority of data mining algorithms fit this pattern - e.g. association, classification, etc.

If you need direct access to strings e.g. BLAST, this approach does not work, and is not currently supported by our plug-in API's (there are still BLAST implementations for SQL Server, however). Note that most string-based problems can be solved by first preprocessing the strings into attributes and then using a traditional algorithm approach. There is some flexibility that you could have you algorithm examine input strings during the training phase, but this approach is not generally recommended and exact strings that were not encountered during the training phase will not be available during the prediction phase in this version.

|||

why there is a requriment of making changes in source code?

i want all in dll

like algorithm should be provided in dll

application will configure itself and add new algorithm

hence i want to generalize all

|||You only need to create the source code for your algorithm. I'm very confused by the direction of the question. The framework allows you to create a DLL or assembly that encapsulates your algorithm and you can plug it into the server directly. The framework is generalized to handle any algorithm that works with attributes and values, e.g. association, classification, estimation, etc.|||

what modifications required for "time series" algorithm ?

is there any modifications we need to do in framework for adding "time series plugin algorithm"

|||

If you want to use the same Time Series function as Microsoft Time Series (i.e. PredictTimeSeries), then:

- your class implementing the IDMAlgorithm should also implement IDMTimeSeriesAlgorithm (both interfaces are defined in the same file, dmalgo.h/idl)

- your metadata class should add DMSF_PredictTimeSeries to the list of supported functions

You could also choose not to use our infrastructure. In this case, the requirements mentioned above do not apply: you can write your own algorithm function to perform forecasting

Plug-in algorithm in data mining using sql server 2005-- modification for association , classifi

managed plug-in framework that's available for download here: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=DF0BA5AA-B4BD-4705-AA0A-B477BA72A9CB&displaylang=en#DMAPI.

This package includes the source code for a sample plug-in algorithm written in C#.

in this source code all .cs files are modified for clustering algorithm

if my plugin algorithm is of association or classification type then what modifications are requried in source code?

Both for classification and for association, you would have to remove the Clustering specific methods from the algorithm object ( ClusterMembership and CaseLikelihood)

If you want to implement an associations algorithm that behaves (in terms of modeling and querying) like Microsoft_Association_Rules, make sure that your plug-in supports:

- nested tables (both input and outputs) (in Metadata.GetSupInputcontentTypes and GetSupPredictContentTypes)

- PredictAssociation (start by enabling this in Algorithmmetadata.GetSupportedStandardFunctions)

For details on how to actually handle nested tables, check the "Attributes and modeling", "The Case processor" and "The Mining Case Object" articles in the CHM file coming with the sample, as well as the documentation for the Predict method of the AlgorithmBase object (same CHM file) and the comments in the sample implementation of this method

Hope this helps

bogdan

|||

is it possible to configure whole code for any type of algorithm

|||

You can have any type of algorithm that works with attribute value pairs. E.g. an attribute "Gender" can have the discrete values "Male","Female", etc., and an attribute Age could have a continuous value such as 45. The majority of data mining algorithms fit this pattern - e.g. association, classification, etc.

If you need direct access to strings e.g. BLAST, this approach does not work, and is not currently supported by our plug-in API's (there are still BLAST implementations for SQL Server, however). Note that most string-based problems can be solved by first preprocessing the strings into attributes and then using a traditional algorithm approach. There is some flexibility that you could have you algorithm examine input strings during the training phase, but this approach is not generally recommended and exact strings that were not encountered during the training phase will not be available during the prediction phase in this version.

|||

why there is a requriment of making changes in source code?

i want all in dll

like algorithm should be provided in dll

application will configure itself and add new algorithm

hence i want to generalize all

|||You only need to create the source code for your algorithm. I'm very confused by the direction of the question. The framework allows you to create a DLL or assembly that encapsulates your algorithm and you can plug it into the server directly. The framework is generalized to handle any algorithm that works with attributes and values, e.g. association, classification, estimation, etc.|||

what modifications required for "time series" algorithm ?

is there any modifications we need to do in framework for adding "time series plugin algorithm"

|||

If you want to use the same Time Series function as Microsoft Time Series (i.e. PredictTimeSeries), then:

- your class implementing the IDMAlgorithm should also implement IDMTimeSeriesAlgorithm (both interfaces are defined in the same file, dmalgo.h/idl)

- your metadata class should add DMSF_PredictTimeSeries to the list of supported functions

You could also choose not to use our infrastructure. In this case, the requirements mentioned above do not apply: you can write your own algorithm function to perform forecasting

Plug-in algorithm in data mining using sql server 2005-- modification for association , classifi

managed plug-in framework that's available for download here: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=DF0BA5AA-B4BD-4705-AA0A-B477BA72A9CB&displaylang=en#DMAPI.

This package includes the source code for a sample plug-in algorithm written in C#.

in this source code all .cs files are modified for clustering algorithm

if my plugin algorithm is of association or classification type then what modifications are requried in source code?

Both for classification and for association, you would have to remove the Clustering specific methods from the algorithm object ( ClusterMembership and CaseLikelihood)

If you want to implement an associations algorithm that behaves (in terms of modeling and querying) like Microsoft_Association_Rules, make sure that your plug-in supports:

- nested tables (both input and outputs) (in Metadata.GetSupInputcontentTypes and GetSupPredictContentTypes)

- PredictAssociation (start by enabling this in Algorithmmetadata.GetSupportedStandardFunctions)

For details on how to actually handle nested tables, check the "Attributes and modeling", "The Case processor" and "The Mining Case Object" articles in the CHM file coming with the sample, as well as the documentation for the Predict method of the AlgorithmBase object (same CHM file) and the comments in the sample implementation of this method

Hope this helps

bogdan

|||

is it possible to configure whole code for any type of algorithm

|||

You can have any type of algorithm that works with attribute value pairs. E.g. an attribute "Gender" can have the discrete values "Male","Female", etc., and an attribute Age could have a continuous value such as 45. The majority of data mining algorithms fit this pattern - e.g. association, classification, etc.

If you need direct access to strings e.g. BLAST, this approach does not work, and is not currently supported by our plug-in API's (there are still BLAST implementations for SQL Server, however). Note that most string-based problems can be solved by first preprocessing the strings into attributes and then using a traditional algorithm approach. There is some flexibility that you could have you algorithm examine input strings during the training phase, but this approach is not generally recommended and exact strings that were not encountered during the training phase will not be available during the prediction phase in this version.

|||

why there is a requriment of making changes in source code?

i want all in dll

like algorithm should be provided in dll

application will configure itself and add new algorithm

hence i want to generalize all

|||You only need to create the source code for your algorithm. I'm very confused by the direction of the question. The framework allows you to create a DLL or assembly that encapsulates your algorithm and you can plug it into the server directly. The framework is generalized to handle any algorithm that works with attributes and values, e.g. association, classification, estimation, etc.|||

what modifications required for "time series" algorithm ?

is there any modifications we need to do in framework for adding "time series plugin algorithm"

|||

If you want to use the same Time Series function as Microsoft Time Series (i.e. PredictTimeSeries), then:

- your class implementing the IDMAlgorithm should also implement IDMTimeSeriesAlgorithm (both interfaces are defined in the same file, dmalgo.h/idl)

- your metadata class should add DMSF_PredictTimeSeries to the list of supported functions

You could also choose not to use our infrastructure. In this case, the requirements mentioned above do not apply: you can write your own algorithm function to perform forecasting

Plug-in algorithm in data mining using sql server 2005-- modification for association , clas

managed plug-in framework that's available for download here: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=DF0BA5AA-B4BD-4705-AA0A-B477BA72A9CB&displaylang=en#DMAPI.

This package includes the source code for a sample plug-in algorithm written in C#.

in this source code all .cs files are modified for clustering algorithm

if my plugin algorithm is of association or classification type then what modifications are requried in source code?

Both for classification and for association, you would have to remove the Clustering specific methods from the algorithm object ( ClusterMembership and CaseLikelihood)

If you want to implement an associations algorithm that behaves (in terms of modeling and querying) like Microsoft_Association_Rules, make sure that your plug-in supports:

- nested tables (both input and outputs) (in Metadata.GetSupInputcontentTypes and GetSupPredictContentTypes)

- PredictAssociation (start by enabling this in Algorithmmetadata.GetSupportedStandardFunctions)

For details on how to actually handle nested tables, check the "Attributes and modeling", "The Case processor" and "The Mining Case Object" articles in the CHM file coming with the sample, as well as the documentation for the Predict method of the AlgorithmBase object (same CHM file) and the comments in the sample implementation of this method

Hope this helps

bogdan

|||

is it possible to configure whole code for any type of algorithm

|||

You can have any type of algorithm that works with attribute value pairs. E.g. an attribute "Gender" can have the discrete values "Male","Female", etc., and an attribute Age could have a continuous value such as 45. The majority of data mining algorithms fit this pattern - e.g. association, classification, etc.

If you need direct access to strings e.g. BLAST, this approach does not work, and is not currently supported by our plug-in API's (there are still BLAST implementations for SQL Server, however). Note that most string-based problems can be solved by first preprocessing the strings into attributes and then using a traditional algorithm approach. There is some flexibility that you could have you algorithm examine input strings during the training phase, but this approach is not generally recommended and exact strings that were not encountered during the training phase will not be available during the prediction phase in this version.

|||

why there is a requriment of making changes in source code?

i want all in dll

like algorithm should be provided in dll

application will configure itself and add new algorithm

hence i want to generalize all

|||You only need to create the source code for your algorithm. I'm very confused by the direction of the question. The framework allows you to create a DLL or assembly that encapsulates your algorithm and you can plug it into the server directly. The framework is generalized to handle any algorithm that works with attributes and values, e.g. association, classification, estimation, etc.|||

what modifications required for "time series" algorithm ?

is there any modifications we need to do in framework for adding "time series plugin algorithm"

|||

If you want to use the same Time Series function as Microsoft Time Series (i.e. PredictTimeSeries), then:

- your class implementing the IDMAlgorithm should also implement IDMTimeSeriesAlgorithm (both interfaces are defined in the same file, dmalgo.h/idl)

- your metadata class should add DMSF_PredictTimeSeries to the list of supported functions

You could also choose not to use our infrastructure. In this case, the requirements mentioned above do not apply: you can write your own algorithm function to perform forecasting

Plug-in algorithm in data mining using sql server 2005-- modification for association , clas

managed plug-in framework that's available for download here: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=DF0BA5AA-B4BD-4705-AA0A-B477BA72A9CB&displaylang=en#DMAPI.

This package includes the source code for a sample plug-in algorithm written in C#.

in this source code all .cs files are modified for clustering algorithm

if my plugin algorithm is of association or classification type then what modifications are requried in source code?

Both for classification and for association, you would have to remove the Clustering specific methods from the algorithm object ( ClusterMembership and CaseLikelihood)

If you want to implement an associations algorithm that behaves (in terms of modeling and querying) like Microsoft_Association_Rules, make sure that your plug-in supports:

- nested tables (both input and outputs) (in Metadata.GetSupInputcontentTypes and GetSupPredictContentTypes)

- PredictAssociation (start by enabling this in Algorithmmetadata.GetSupportedStandardFunctions)

For details on how to actually handle nested tables, check the "Attributes and modeling", "The Case processor" and "The Mining Case Object" articles in the CHM file coming with the sample, as well as the documentation for the Predict method of the AlgorithmBase object (same CHM file) and the comments in the sample implementation of this method

Hope this helps

bogdan

|||

is it possible to configure whole code for any type of algorithm

|||

You can have any type of algorithm that works with attribute value pairs. E.g. an attribute "Gender" can have the discrete values "Male","Female", etc., and an attribute Age could have a continuous value such as 45. The majority of data mining algorithms fit this pattern - e.g. association, classification, etc.

If you need direct access to strings e.g. BLAST, this approach does not work, and is not currently supported by our plug-in API's (there are still BLAST implementations for SQL Server, however). Note that most string-based problems can be solved by first preprocessing the strings into attributes and then using a traditional algorithm approach. There is some flexibility that you could have you algorithm examine input strings during the training phase, but this approach is not generally recommended and exact strings that were not encountered during the training phase will not be available during the prediction phase in this version.

|||

why there is a requriment of making changes in source code?

i want all in dll

like algorithm should be provided in dll

application will configure itself and add new algorithm

hence i want to generalize all

|||You only need to create the source code for your algorithm. I'm very confused by the direction of the question. The framework allows you to create a DLL or assembly that encapsulates your algorithm and you can plug it into the server directly. The framework is generalized to handle any algorithm that works with attributes and values, e.g. association, classification, estimation, etc.|||

what modifications required for "time series" algorithm ?

is there any modifications we need to do in framework for adding "time series plugin algorithm"

|||

If you want to use the same Time Series function as Microsoft Time Series (i.e. PredictTimeSeries), then:

- your class implementing the IDMAlgorithm should also implement IDMTimeSeriesAlgorithm (both interfaces are defined in the same file, dmalgo.h/idl)

- your metadata class should add DMSF_PredictTimeSeries to the list of supported functions

You could also choose not to use our infrastructure. In this case, the requirements mentioned above do not apply: you can write your own algorithm function to perform forecasting

Please help.....

We had a NT4 server with SQL 7 installed. AS it happened the machine complete
bombed out. I managed to copy the data folder from the SQL installation
diretory before the whole hdd went up in flames.
I am basically stuck now with *.mdf and *.ldf which both are about 100+ megs
and I really want to import this database into SQL 2000.
I have attached the database succefully and can see it there. Even the OBDC
test is successfull. However the application which is CRM Superoffice doens;t
want to log on as it says invalid username and password.
I am sure that I might have missed seomthing. Do I first need to some
coverting of some sort from a SQL 7 to SQl 2000 database? Keep in mind that
we no longer have SQL 7 but just the data directory of that installation. No
backups were done of this machine ( as usual )
Can I do anything at all?
Please, any help is appreciated.
Regards
Gian
Gian
Did you move all logins from source database to the destination?
"Gian" <Gian@.discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:E0696A35-26A3-4FAA-BA1C-78E08275F81D@.microsoft.com...
> We had a NT4 server with SQL 7 installed. AS it happened the machine
complete
> bombed out. I managed to copy the data folder from the SQL installation
> diretory before the whole hdd went up in flames.
> I am basically stuck now with *.mdf and *.ldf which both are about 100+
megs
> and I really want to import this database into SQL 2000.
> I have attached the database succefully and can see it there. Even the
OBDC
> test is successfull. However the application which is CRM Superoffice
doens;t
> want to log on as it says invalid username and password.
> I am sure that I might have missed seomthing. Do I first need to some
> coverting of some sort from a SQL 7 to SQl 2000 database? Keep in mind
that
> we no longer have SQL 7 but just the data directory of that installation.
No
> backups were done of this machine ( as usual )
> Can I do anything at all?
> Please, any help is appreciated.
> Regards
> Gian
|||Sounds like the database is fine, but you may need to reattach database user
accounts.
See sp_change_users_login to see if you just need to realign the database
user accounts with the logins
"Gian" <Gian@.discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:E0696A35-26A3-4FAA-BA1C-78E08275F81D@.microsoft.com...
> We had a NT4 server with SQL 7 installed. AS it happened the machine
complete
> bombed out. I managed to copy the data folder from the SQL installation
> diretory before the whole hdd went up in flames.
> I am basically stuck now with *.mdf and *.ldf which both are about 100+
megs
> and I really want to import this database into SQL 2000.
> I have attached the database succefully and can see it there. Even the
OBDC
> test is successfull. However the application which is CRM Superoffice
doens;t
> want to log on as it says invalid username and password.
> I am sure that I might have missed seomthing. Do I first need to some
> coverting of some sort from a SQL 7 to SQl 2000 database? Keep in mind
that
> we no longer have SQL 7 but just the data directory of that installation.
No
> backups were done of this machine ( as usual )
> Can I do anything at all?
> Please, any help is appreciated.
> Regards
> Gian
|||Hi,
Since you did an attach of databases, I am sure that you have not moved the
system databases from sql 7 to sql 2000.
All the SQL server logins will be kept in master database. So since you have
not copied the logins the SID in syslogins will not
match with SID in sysusers of each database. To resync the syslogins with
sysusers, refer the procedure "sp_change_users_login"
in sql server books online.
One more thing is after sync. you may need to make the CRM user to default
to that user database using the below system procedure
sp_defaultdb 'login_name','database_name'
Thanks
Hari
MCDBA
"Gian" <Gian@.discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:E0696A35-26A3-4FAA-BA1C-78E08275F81D@.microsoft.com...
> We had a NT4 server with SQL 7 installed. AS it happened the machine
complete
> bombed out. I managed to copy the data folder from the SQL installation
> diretory before the whole hdd went up in flames.
> I am basically stuck now with *.mdf and *.ldf which both are about 100+
megs
> and I really want to import this database into SQL 2000.
> I have attached the database succefully and can see it there. Even the
OBDC
> test is successfull. However the application which is CRM Superoffice
doens;t
> want to log on as it says invalid username and password.
> I am sure that I might have missed seomthing. Do I first need to some
> coverting of some sort from a SQL 7 to SQl 2000 database? Keep in mind
that
> we no longer have SQL 7 but just the data directory of that installation.
No
> backups were done of this machine ( as usual )
> Can I do anything at all?
> Please, any help is appreciated.
> Regards
> Gian
|||Gian,
Things to check.
1) Did you import all the logins from the old server?
2) Are the logins mapped to the correct users in your attached database?
sp_change_users_login can help here.
3) Is the security mode the same as the old server? i.e. are you using
Windows Authentication Only or Mixed mode? Check that this is correct
because a standard SQL login will not be allowed on a Windows
Authentication Only server.
Also have a look at:
Microsoft Knowledge Base Article - 224071
Moving SQL Server databases to a new location with Detach/Attach
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=224071
Mark Allison, SQL Server MVP
http://www.markallison.co.uk
Looking for a SQL Server replication book?
http://www.nwsu.com/0974973602.html
Gian wrote:
> We had a NT4 server with SQL 7 installed. AS it happened the machine complete
> bombed out. I managed to copy the data folder from the SQL installation
> diretory before the whole hdd went up in flames.
> I am basically stuck now with *.mdf and *.ldf which both are about 100+ megs
> and I really want to import this database into SQL 2000.
> I have attached the database succefully and can see it there. Even the OBDC
> test is successfull. However the application which is CRM Superoffice doens;t
> want to log on as it says invalid username and password.
> I am sure that I might have missed seomthing. Do I first need to some
> coverting of some sort from a SQL 7 to SQl 2000 database? Keep in mind that
> we no longer have SQL 7 but just the data directory of that installation. No
> backups were done of this machine ( as usual )
> Can I do anything at all?
> Please, any help is appreciated.
> Regards
> Gian

Please help.....

We had a NT4 server with SQL 7 installed. AS it happened the machine complete
bombed out. I managed to copy the data folder from the SQL installation
diretory before the whole hdd went up in flames.
I am basically stuck now with *.mdf and *.ldf which both are about 100+ megs
and I really want to import this database into SQL 2000.
I have attached the database succefully and can see it there. Even the OBDC
test is successfull. However the application which is CRM Superoffice doens;t
want to log on as it says invalid username and password.
I am sure that I might have missed seomthing. Do I first need to some
coverting of some sort from a SQL 7 to SQl 2000 database? Keep in mind that
we no longer have SQL 7 but just the data directory of that installation. No
backups were done of this machine ( as usual )
Can I do anything at all?
Please, any help is appreciated.
Regards
GianGian
Did you move all logins from source database to the destination?
"Gian" <Gian@.discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:E0696A35-26A3-4FAA-BA1C-78E08275F81D@.microsoft.com...
> We had a NT4 server with SQL 7 installed. AS it happened the machine
complete
> bombed out. I managed to copy the data folder from the SQL installation
> diretory before the whole hdd went up in flames.
> I am basically stuck now with *.mdf and *.ldf which both are about 100+
megs
> and I really want to import this database into SQL 2000.
> I have attached the database succefully and can see it there. Even the
OBDC
> test is successfull. However the application which is CRM Superoffice
doens;t
> want to log on as it says invalid username and password.
> I am sure that I might have missed seomthing. Do I first need to some
> coverting of some sort from a SQL 7 to SQl 2000 database? Keep in mind
that
> we no longer have SQL 7 but just the data directory of that installation.
No
> backups were done of this machine ( as usual )
> Can I do anything at all?
> Please, any help is appreciated.
> Regards
> Gian|||Sounds like the database is fine, but you may need to reattach database user
accounts.
See sp_change_users_login to see if you just need to realign the database
user accounts with the logins
"Gian" <Gian@.discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:E0696A35-26A3-4FAA-BA1C-78E08275F81D@.microsoft.com...
> We had a NT4 server with SQL 7 installed. AS it happened the machine
complete
> bombed out. I managed to copy the data folder from the SQL installation
> diretory before the whole hdd went up in flames.
> I am basically stuck now with *.mdf and *.ldf which both are about 100+
megs
> and I really want to import this database into SQL 2000.
> I have attached the database succefully and can see it there. Even the
OBDC
> test is successfull. However the application which is CRM Superoffice
doens;t
> want to log on as it says invalid username and password.
> I am sure that I might have missed seomthing. Do I first need to some
> coverting of some sort from a SQL 7 to SQl 2000 database? Keep in mind
that
> we no longer have SQL 7 but just the data directory of that installation.
No
> backups were done of this machine ( as usual )
> Can I do anything at all?
> Please, any help is appreciated.
> Regards
> Gian|||Hi,
Since you did an attach of databases, I am sure that you have not moved the
system databases from sql 7 to sql 2000.
All the SQL server logins will be kept in master database. So since you have
not copied the logins the SID in syslogins will not
match with SID in sysusers of each database. To resync the syslogins with
sysusers, refer the procedure "sp_change_users_login"
in sql server books online.
One more thing is after sync. you may need to make the CRM user to default
to that user database using the below system procedure
sp_defaultdb 'login_name','database_name'
Thanks
Hari
MCDBA
"Gian" <Gian@.discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:E0696A35-26A3-4FAA-BA1C-78E08275F81D@.microsoft.com...
> We had a NT4 server with SQL 7 installed. AS it happened the machine
complete
> bombed out. I managed to copy the data folder from the SQL installation
> diretory before the whole hdd went up in flames.
> I am basically stuck now with *.mdf and *.ldf which both are about 100+
megs
> and I really want to import this database into SQL 2000.
> I have attached the database succefully and can see it there. Even the
OBDC
> test is successfull. However the application which is CRM Superoffice
doens;t
> want to log on as it says invalid username and password.
> I am sure that I might have missed seomthing. Do I first need to some
> coverting of some sort from a SQL 7 to SQl 2000 database? Keep in mind
that
> we no longer have SQL 7 but just the data directory of that installation.
No
> backups were done of this machine ( as usual )
> Can I do anything at all?
> Please, any help is appreciated.
> Regards
> Gian|||Gian,
Things to check.
1) Did you import all the logins from the old server?
2) Are the logins mapped to the correct users in your attached database?
sp_change_users_login can help here.
3) Is the security mode the same as the old server? i.e. are you using
Windows Authentication Only or Mixed mode? Check that this is correct
because a standard SQL login will not be allowed on a Windows
Authentication Only server.
Also have a look at:
Microsoft Knowledge Base Article - 224071
Moving SQL Server databases to a new location with Detach/Attach
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=224071
--
Mark Allison, SQL Server MVP
http://www.markallison.co.uk
Looking for a SQL Server replication book?
http://www.nwsu.com/0974973602.html
Gian wrote:
> We had a NT4 server with SQL 7 installed. AS it happened the machine complete
> bombed out. I managed to copy the data folder from the SQL installation
> diretory before the whole hdd went up in flames.
> I am basically stuck now with *.mdf and *.ldf which both are about 100+ megs
> and I really want to import this database into SQL 2000.
> I have attached the database succefully and can see it there. Even the OBDC
> test is successfull. However the application which is CRM Superoffice doens;t
> want to log on as it says invalid username and password.
> I am sure that I might have missed seomthing. Do I first need to some
> coverting of some sort from a SQL 7 to SQl 2000 database? Keep in mind that
> we no longer have SQL 7 but just the data directory of that installation. No
> backups were done of this machine ( as usual )
> Can I do anything at all?
> Please, any help is appreciated.
> Regards
> Gian